The Black Boy II

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Ollycat
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The Black Boy II

Post by Ollycat »

Piwacket said last summer:

The Black Boy at Shinfield - gives an explanation ....
https://www.baronspubs.com/blackboy/about/

...when it was changing hands a couple or so years ago, you may recollect there were the inevitable calls to change the name! The pub/licensee - whoever, won the argument not to :)


Well, the discussion is back again. Greene King have 3 pubs called the Black Boy they want to rename. There's to be a poll.

https://www.wokingham.today/75028-2/
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by dave m »

To be honest, I always thought it was a King Charles link that had been corrupted to show a black child at some point.
Wouldn't it be sensible to stay with history, and 'restore" the link with Charles, removing any potential non PC association?

That would clarify the name (I hate chains that rename pubs) and also remove any distasteful links like one of those jockey things that people put up for horses to be third to? Pub names allow people to find locations from names 100 years ago.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Fed-up »

According to his map from 1899, the pub was directly opposite a blacksmiths - https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/?#zoom= ... rs=168&b=1

I wonder how it got its name? :whistle1:
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piwacket
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Re: The Black Boy II

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Fed-up wrote: 15 Jan 2021 13:30 According to his map from 1899, the pub was directly opposite a blacksmiths - https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/?#zoom= ... rs=168&b=1

I wonder how it got its name? :whistle1:
The link in the first post gives you the background https://www.baronspubs.com/blackboy/about/

It now shows a sign depicting a black horse, presumably a stallion? Call it the Black Horse - job done.
Like others, I hate to see pubs’ names changed... and this one has been known by its present name for decades that I know of... whatever it’s changed to, long term locals will still refer to it as such, but at least Black Horse is somewhat similar - and surely can’t be offensive... any more than a Black Labrador or black cat, or blackbird :?
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Fed-up
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Fed-up »

The link on the pub website appears to be talking about the name "Black Boy" in general rather than in this particular instance, which is why I looked at the map to see if it could give any clues.
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Bam
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Bam »

The name could mean whatever you wish it to e.g. Lewis Hamilton, a black boy that has done well and supported black boys world wide. A couple of photos of him in the pub should do the trick. But please don't change tha name.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Pooneil »

Bam wrote: 15 Jan 2021 15:00The name could mean whatever you wish it to e.g. Lewis Hamilton, a black boy that has done well and supported black boys world wide. A couple of photos of him in the pub should do the trick. But please don't change tha name.
Not that simple - the use of "boy" when describing black men has racist connatations, given that was the way slave owners in the American South referred to their adult male slaves.
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lizwing
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by lizwing »

How about The Boy of Colour 😊
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by piwacket »

Latest update
https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/readi ... e-19768590

Personally, `I don’t think any of them are suitable :shrug1:
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by lizwing »

Usually pubs with arms after the name had some link with a member of the nobility, so Shinfield Arms can be discounted, unless the pub belonged to the Earl of Shinfield, King’s Rest, no that’s sexist, Merry Monarch, no that will offend teetotallers and anti monarchists. Let’s face it someone’s going to be offended whatever it’s called. Also the book referred to says ...there might have been two men in Reading who kept slaves equally there might not.
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wirewiper
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by wirewiper »

How about simply "The Shinfield"? I do think it needs to be renamed from Black Boy - if we can't say for certain that it has racist connections, we can't be sure that it doesn't either.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Pooneil »

How about The Black Horse, since that was what it was allegedly called after.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

wirewiper wrote: 05 Feb 2021 16:13 How about simply "The Shinfield"? I do think it needs to be renamed from Black Boy - if we can't say for certain that it has racist connections, we can't be sure that it doesn't either.
The 'Shining Field' which is supposedly where Shinfield comes from. It would no doubt be abbreviated.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by piwacket »

Pooneil wrote: 05 Feb 2021 16:16 How about The Black Horse, since that was what it was allegedly called after.
That’s certainly my thinking too.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by wirewiper »

Pooneil wrote: 05 Feb 2021 16:16 How about The Black Horse, since that was what it was allegedly called after.
That could work too.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by 4String »

The Black Horse, great idea.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by dave m »

The Black Bouy ?

With a sillouette of a boat tied up?
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by D5equj5 »

I've seen a good many pubs in my time and must say "The Temporary Sign" seems a very popular name. Many pubs seem to have dallied with the name over the years.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

dave m wrote: 06 Feb 2021 17:28 The Black Bouy ?

With a sillouette of a boat tied up?
There's a Black Buoy in Wivenhoe, so they might object. If you went with Black Bouy, then it's likely to offend Ouasim Bouy.

But surely one of the key features of a buoy is that it's visible?

How about 'M4 View'?
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by dave m »

Oops!

Yup - my"English" pronunciation couldn't reconcile itself with the "American" version
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by lizwing »

Buoy is the correct spelling in English Dave, the Americans actually pronounce it like that whereas we tend to say boy.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

Buoy, quay, boatswain etc. What is it with these nortickle types?
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Pooneil »

lizwing wrote: 07 Feb 2021 09:12Buoy is the correct spelling in English Dave, the Americans actually pronounce it like that whereas we tend to say boy.
In my experience, Americans pronounce it "boo-ee", which isn’t exactly as it is spelled.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by lizwing »

Maybe not but not boy, which was my point.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by OLDMAN »

I think it should be the The Garden Centre or The DIY Shop, then at least it can open for us to visit” :whistle1:

Or.....The Black Smiths House
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by Fed-up »

OLDMAN wrote: 08 Feb 2021 07:46 Or.....The Black Smiths House
Looking at old maps, there was a smithy directly opposite where the pub is, so that would be an appropriate name.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/?#zoom= ... yers=6&b=1
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

That's settled then, it's the "Stop that bloody hammering, I'm trying to have a quiet pint arms".
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by windrush »

Well I believe that 'The Green Man and Black's Head' in Ashbourne (the longest pub sign in the world) appears to be keeping its name and having the black persons head reinstated now last years controversity has died a death so I can't see why the Black Boy feels the need to change? :?

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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by piwacket »

windrush wrote: 08 Feb 2021 10:01 Well I believe that 'The Green Man and Black's Head' in Ashbourne (the longest pub sign in the world) appears to be keeping its name and having the black persons head reinstated now last years controversity has died a death so I can't see why the Black Boy feels the need to change? :?

Pete.
... it’s not The Black Boy’s tenant Managers - it’s the owners - Greene King - who want to change it.... helped along of course by the BLM agenda....
And The Black Smith - a very sound suggestion - still has ‘black’ in its title :bigeyes1: so probably not acceptable either! Or they’d find a reason why not.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by OLDMAN »

Fed-up wrote: 08 Feb 2021 08:26
OLDMAN wrote: 08 Feb 2021 07:46 Or.....The Black Smiths House
Looking at old maps, there was a smithy directly opposite where the pub is, so that would be an appropriate name.

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/?#zoom= ... yers=6&b=1
And why I chose it
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

It needs to be more up to date. "The Confusing New Road Layout" gets my vote.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by KeithW »

The Shinfield Arms according to the local rag.
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by piwacket »

KeithW wrote: 11 Feb 2021 16:44 The Shinfield Arms according to the local rag.
:)) shows really good imagination :roll:
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Re: The Black Boy II

Post by lizwing »

Presumably then there is an Earl of Shinfield ?
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Re: The Black Boy II

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lizwing wrote: 11 Feb 2021 18:02 Presumably then there is an Earl of Shinfield ?
? Does there have to be an Earl of Shinfield? and what does it actually mean - that this noble kept his ‘Arms/Armaments there?
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