Reading Golf Club Development

User avatar
piwacket
Moderator
Posts: 31349
Joined: 15 Aug 2006 22:05

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by piwacket »

Pooneil wrote: 25 Sep 2020 16:52 Blimey, I didn't think there were any medieval cathedral builders still in business :wink:
:))

https://ukpropertyforums.com/oxfordshir ... es-bridge/

https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/readi ... s-17876520
There's no such thing as a free lunch
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

piwacket wrote: 25 Sep 2020 17:37
Pooneil wrote: 25 Sep 2020 16:52 Blimey, I didn't think there were any medieval cathedral builders still in business :wink:
:))

https://ukpropertyforums.com/oxfordshir ... es-bridge/

https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/readi ... s-17876520
Granted, with all the consultations, nature surveys, planning hearings, appeals, referral to the Secretary of State etc that's probably 5 or 6 years, and I imagine purchasing the necessary land could take two or three years, but after that it's just building a relatively modest bridge over a relatively modest bit of river, with a road at each end. Even the Humber Bridge, then the world's longest single-span suspension bridge, took less than a decade to actually build, and that's about a mile and a third of actual bridge over a ruddy wide bit of river. I struggle to see why more than 15 years would be required, and even that's with an awful lot of mithering about. And I'm sure if there was an impetus to fast-track it, under a decade would be feasible. The danger of saying "well we don't know what it will be like in the future" is we all sit around and wait for the future and still keep saying "but we don't know what demand will be like in 10 years time". True, but if we keep taking that approach we're always still wondering about what happens in 10 or 20 years time and nothing ever gets done. Today is always yesterday's tomorrow, and the future is always manana.

In reality, if it were a national emergency I'm sure the Royal Engineers could have something up by Monday lunchtime. OK, Tuesday morning given that it's now Friday evening :-)
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
User avatar
MickEdge
Super Contributor
Posts: 2247
Joined: 08 Jul 2015 14:54

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by MickEdge »

Mayfield wrote: 25 Sep 2020 17:09 I doubt it will get through anyway but also I suspect the developers will keep going....
I wouldn’t be so sure. After all half the land is down for housing by RBC, so even if refused it might get permission on appeal.
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Appeal is long and expensive ...and Ties up the developers funds all the time, but I see the point...in the meantime I wonder if the sale of a million pound plus house on the Peppard Road is because they fear future development ?
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

MickEdge wrote: 25 Sep 2020 18:58
Mayfield wrote: 25 Sep 2020 17:09 I doubt it will get through anyway but also I suspect the developers will keep going....
I wouldn’t be so sure. After all half the land is down for housing by RBC, so even if refused it might get permission on appeal.
But don't forget the local plan has already been through the planning inspector who said they can only build 100 houses if Golf remains on the rest of the site. Inspectors rarely over rule inspectors!

There is a very good letter submitted by a local estate agent in the comments of the 18th September. Its superbly composed by someone who is both a local community member and a member of the golf club.
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

It seems that RGCs and the land acquisition company's chosen house build partner has pulled out balming COVID-19. But was it local opposition or other reasons. No-one will even know. This is the second house builder to pull out. Looks like the development will now be by a Barratt owned company - bad news for all in my opinion Their developments under the Linden banner in Sonning Common are not particularly attractive. Apparently all of these house builders have been carefully chosen in order to provide the best legacy for Emmer Green - I think they are probably running out of options in all honesty!
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

I see that Reading Golf Club withdrew their planning application last week, although apparently they will be resubmitting a revised application. BBC report
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

I see this is back on the agenda again with very few alterations .....
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

This new planning application is a complete insult to the over 2000 objections to this. It is sad to see that the Golf club continue to push ahead with this same proposal despite the objections and community challenge. It shows the golf club don't want to leave the legacy to the area they claim they do.

Sadly, to me, this also gives the impression that RBC are also comfortable with the development and it was only a matter of meeting policy requirements such as road widths etc!

As you know Mayfield the additional traffic element of this proposal will impact us greatly and the proposed 5 year build times even more. Sad times if this goes ahead!
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Sadly this has the same feeling as Bugs Bottom...it’s not ‘if’ it’s ‘when’. It seems unlikely that the plan will go away totally unless another business with a bigger interest in leisure steps forward...or the community set about raising the money themselves or somehow protecting the land.

Do the golf club have a plan B ?

I do think the lady who posted on Social Media yesterday was unwise to link this new application with Covid and mental health, tempting though it may be. No doubt they did feel it’s ‘all too much’ but the application is from a business who will have no such emotions.

I’ve long said I’m not a great believer in children living in flats, we just aren’t set up for it...and I firmly believe most people with families would like a home with a garden and people have to live somewhere....however at present the roads and facilities, doctors, schools etc aren’t really set up for an increase in population in that area.
And as you say it could be several years of very disruptive work and change the area to something you didn’t bank on when you moved there...

Not good news....
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Tonight on FB a map has appeared which shows markers where golf club members live, either in red if they are pro the development and blue if they are against it.
I’m amazed this information is in the public domain ...do the golf club publish it ?
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

Mayfield wrote: 15 Feb 2021 23:12 Tonight on FB a map has appeared which shows markers where golf club members live, either in red if they are pro the development and blue if they are against it.
I’m amazed this information is in the public domain ...do the golf club publish it ?
That's not quite what the map is Mayfield.

The map is of objectors and supporters whoever they may be. Quite rightly people are questioning why someone in Calcot, or Tilehurst or Sonning would support the development so far away from them (and would even realise it existed - would you know if they wanted to build 250 houses on Calcot golf club, possibly, would you support or object to it - probably not!) the only explanation being that that potentially have a vested interest by being members of the club.

The are using some for of script to read the planning website to create the map - I'm not sure how too clever for me but all the information is already in the public domain so I think it is OK.

Interestingly there are much wider reaching support this time round and more in the area. The golf club have been obviously rallied given the response from the community last time.

EDIT - Mayfield I am sorry but it does state (you are correct) that 90% of the objectors are Golf Club Members. I am not sure how they have that info but I know there are some golf club members very much against these proposals so it may just be a case of knowing the membership! However the markers don't specifically show where the members live the show the address an objection has come from.
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Are there any moves on behalf of objectors to find an alternative plan ? Less houses or another Leisure facility for example ?
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

Mayfield wrote: 17 Feb 2021 14:17 Are there any moves on behalf of objectors to find an alternative plan ? Less houses or another Leisure facility for example ?
I think the official line of KEG is that they are not going to play into the hands of the developers and tell them what is acceptable in their minds.

Reality is that with 100 to 130 houses in the local plan if they submitted for this amount that would likely be approved. I think its still too many given the access and traffic issues, and school numbers though. There was a good letter last time from a prominent local business man who is also a member of the club suggesting that a development within the local plan numbers and redeveloping the club house etc would ensure the future viability of the club at its current site.

There is a suggestion that this hadn't been explored because members had been promised 6 figure returns and therefore voted for wholesale selloff.

I think what gets to me most is that they continue to say the club was not viable in the current location with the current facilities and clubhouse. however accounts on companies house do not support this. There has also never been any applications to rebuild the clubhouse on the current site, build new facilities on the current site etc. There is actually a lot of land not used by the actual course and not backing onto residential (extensive boundary with the school field for example) which would allow them to bring in more money / weddings etc. Maybe they would have been rejected but maybe not we will never know.

I think a small residential development fronting the road (30 to 50 houses), new clubhouse capable of holding event weddings etc and community facilities further into the site and adjustment of the course to replace the lost holes would be acceptable.
User avatar
piwacket
Moderator
Posts: 31349
Joined: 15 Aug 2006 22:05

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by piwacket »

eddieed wrote: 17 Feb 2021 17:26 Reality is that with 100 to 130 houses in the local plan if they submitted for this amount that would likely be approved.
I guess you’ve seen this? Apparently new plans have been submitted
https://keepemmergreen.com/?fbclid=IwAR ... 4twOLx_8_Q
There's no such thing as a free lunch
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

piwacket wrote: 23 Feb 2021 19:50
eddieed wrote: 17 Feb 2021 17:26 Reality is that with 100 to 130 houses in the local plan if they submitted for this amount that would likely be approved.
I guess you’ve seen this? Apparently new plans have been submitted
https://keepemmergreen.com/?fbclid=IwAR ... 4twOLx_8_Q
I thought I'd posted the BBC News report, but clearly I hadn't...
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

Mayfield wrote: 08 Feb 2021 17:57I’ve long said I’m not a great believer in children living in flats, we just aren’t set up for it...and I firmly believe most people with families would like a home with a garden and people have to live somewhere....however at present the roads and facilities, doctors, schools etc aren’t really set up for an increase in population in that area.
That's hardly much of an argument - I doubt there are very many places in the whole country where they have a surfeit of school paces, GP surgeries, dentists etc just waiting for people to come and build homes. And if there were, there would probably be a pressure to close the excess to save money. This sort of stuff has to be factored into developments, not the absence of it used as an objection.
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Quite ...

In fact not very long ago the founding of the Heights did, reportedly lead to a surfeit of school places with some established local schools complaining they had lost funds....
User avatar
MickEdge
Super Contributor
Posts: 2247
Joined: 08 Jul 2015 14:54

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by MickEdge »

If post-Covid-19 we really are going to have more distributed workplaces (home-offices), do we need to continue to concentrate housing in are most economically thriving, densely populated, congested and polluted towns and cities?
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

We may not need to but the debate like Emmer Green will go on in virtually every community that thinks it special .....
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

Looks like over 3000 objections this time. Shows that this is not the Legacy the community want the golf club to leave!
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

It seems that the residents association know that this won’t be the end of the battle, and allowing people to object on behalf of their under 16scwas bound to increase the numbers...

In addition to continuing opposition is there any mileage in meeting the developers with a view to finding a compromise ? Because at present this just seems to be increasing the price of the houses ....or are they looking for someone to develop it as a leisure facility ?

Now they also seem to be objecting to apartments for the elderly at the BBC, one bright spark on FB also suggested it would put extra pressure on school places 🙄
eddieed
Super Contributor
Posts: 1526
Joined: 04 May 2012 09:46

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by eddieed »

I agree Mayfield -my impression is that there is no interest on that from either side at present. There will be building on this site - the right thing would have been for the golf club to survive and a number of houses built that allowed them to put themselves financially right probably up to 100 on the land that is in the local plan (although I question whether this is still sustainable given the single lane road leading to the site in both directions). Sadly they jumped into the agreement with Caversham Heath and this has now become a bit of a noose around their neck as they don't need 2 courses.

The BBC site will be an interesting one - there is limited land to be developed there as it is listed as designed by Capability Brown. Old people flats sound like a reasonable option. I wouldn't support any houses being built separately.

Objections to planning are only valid if they have planning rules in them. We sent one from the household I'm not convinced of multiple letters the same as being a good idea. It will be interesting to see - RBC objected to the Gladman development on the boundary of Reading based on its impact on the local infrastructure including roads. This is almost exactly the same number of houses!!
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

I see Keep Emmer Green have come up with a ‘brilliant’ idea

: https://keepemmergreen.com/grove-arbore ... 28gToVr_YY

An arboretum ….
User avatar
Bam
Super Contributor
Posts: 8297
Joined: 05 Feb 2003 19:40

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Bam »

All unspoiled, productive, picturesque farm land in my day. The golf course came as a shock but I was long gone by then. Is Blagraves Lane still a lovely tree tunnel ?
User avatar
MickEdge
Super Contributor
Posts: 2247
Joined: 08 Jul 2015 14:54

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by MickEdge »

Bam wrote: 07 Jul 2021 09:51 All unspoiled, productive, picturesque farm land in my day. The golf course came as a shock but I was long gone by then. Is Blagraves Lane still a lovely tree tunnel ?
I think you’re confusing the Emmer Green suggestions with The Caversham, as they insist on calling that golf club now, which is to the west of the A4074, as it leaves Caversham. It was taken over by Reading Golf Club, whose course is closed. Yes, both Blargrave Lane and Blagrave Farm Lane still exist and remain largely unspoilt.
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

I see that the RBC planning officers are recommending to the council that they turn down the application to protect open spaces and prevent environmental harm, amongst other reasons.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-b ... e-57847840
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Well - it will give those who want an Arboretum a chance to source the funds 🙂
User avatar
MickEdge
Super Contributor
Posts: 2247
Joined: 08 Jul 2015 14:54

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by MickEdge »

Mayfield wrote: 17 Jul 2021 14:30 Well - it will give those who want an Arboretum a chance to source the funds 🙂
Lovely idea, but never going to happen.
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

In that case it will give them a chance to discover that - I suspect you are correct though..
Pooneil
Moderator
Posts: 8134
Joined: 10 May 2011 00:57

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Pooneil »

Just to confirm that the councillors followed the recommendations and unanimously turned down the planning application...
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

I doubt anyone thinks that will be end of the story - apparently at the meeting some councillors were keen to see affordable housing built …probably not what the golf club had in mind .

I was a bit discouraged today to read that despite a significant increase in Woodland , wild life has declined ….
User avatar
piwacket
Moderator
Posts: 31349
Joined: 15 Aug 2006 22:05

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by piwacket »

Mayfield wrote: 27 Jul 2021 22:56 I doubt anyone thinks that will be end of the story - apparently at the meeting some councillors were keen to see affordable housing built …probably not what the golf club had in mind .
I think you’re probably right, there’s bound to be another attempt - but also agree it’s probably not what the golf club want :) one could say, ‘why would they’? If Calcot is anything to go by…. However, wouldn’t the developers be obliged to incorporate a percentage within the development?
There's no such thing as a free lunch
Mayfield
Moderator
Posts: 14161
Joined: 15 Nov 2007 18:50

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Mayfield »

Usually , I wonder if that was the flat content of the development ?
User avatar
Voiceoftreason?
Super Contributor
Posts: 16486
Joined: 04 Jun 2013 21:14

Re: Reading Golf Club Development

Post by Voiceoftreason? »

Mayfield wrote: 27 Jul 2021 23:41 Usually , I wonder if that was the flat content of the development ?
Often it’s scattered around any reasonable size development. Some councils are keen that there’s not any ‘poor door’ kind of demarcation or stigma attached to the social housing within the development. I feel it’s a mix of flats and houses, I would anticipate that the social housing element would also be a mix of flats and housing. I guess it would show on the plans, somewhere.
Disclaimer: it wasn't me as wot said it, it was my iPad spellchecker!
Post Reply

Return to “Property developments in Reading”