L&Q Homebase & Toys R Us Redevelopment (Kenavon Drive)

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peterson
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L&Q Homebase & Toys R Us Redevelopment (Kenavon Drive)

Post by peterson »

A pre-application submitted for up to 800 flats
http://planning.reading.gov.uk/fastweb_ ... Ref=160733

Riverside square CGI_2000x2000.jpg
River-view-UPDATED.jpg

Current Status
Planning

Website
http://www.lq-kenavondrive.co.uk/

Map
roof plan with shadow - web_1000x706.jpg
Last edited by peterson on 21 Apr 2016 23:17, edited 1 time in total.
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piwacket
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by piwacket »

Flats! again!
Is there no end to the number of flats being built or developed - surely it's about time ''homes'' were built and not pied-á-terres?
There's no such thing as a free lunch
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by C8H10N4O2 »

If I'm alone, by all means tell me so, but I struggle to find good reason to visit anyone's blog "offered" as a contribution to a community site.
Sorry, but I just don't see anything but self-promotion.
2sheds
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by 2sheds »

I think it far better to post as a blog and link to that rather than post the ideas ideas here verbatim. And I think they're great, thought provoking ideas too. The land area there could certainly benefit from some joined up planning and marriage value of the different sites. That isn't always obvious and needs some dreamers to show what could be achieved if you push some of the stars into alignment. Planning dictates the communities that we end up living in so it's better as a community forum that we're informed as opposed to in the dark. Usually you wouldn't hear of these matters until there's a full application and by that time it's usually too late to steer the ship.
peterson
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by peterson »

C8H10N4O2 wrote:If I'm alone, by all means tell me so, but I struggle to find good reason to visit anyone's blog "offered" as a contribution to a community site.
Sorry, but I just don't see anything but self-promotion.
Happy to stop if that's the mod view. I've no intention of competing with this community forum that I've supported since 2003. I just decided to start a blog to publish slightly longer form pieces. It makes no money and I write anonymously, so not really self-promotion.
This forum remains the best place online for a discussion about Reading!
Yola

Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by Yola »

I really value Peterson's contributions and the blog s/he produces. They are well written and always present interesting facts and calmly reasoned opinions. How is it self-promotion when the blog is anonymous and promoting nothing more than observations?

Obviously I'm not a mod so can easily be overruled but I welcome the links and always read them.
ReadingT
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by ReadingT »

It is self promotion because to find out his thoughts you have to visit his blog. He could post them here but doesn't. There is no need for it. This is a forum in its own right. It is bad enough with Edible Reading locking down the restaurant section of the forum.

As for Toys R Us and Homebase closing for more flats, eugh. Some developers won't be happy until there are flat in every single location and nothing else.
Last edited by ReadingT on 21 Apr 2016 23:18, edited 1 time in total.
peterson
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by peterson »

Link removed
Pooneil
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by Pooneil »

ReadingT wrote:It is self promotion because to find out his thoughts you have to visit his blog. He could post them here but doesn't. There is no need for it. This is a forum in its own right. It is bad enough with Edible Reading locking down the restaurant section of the forum.
I'm with Yola; I find the blogs interesting, and don't really see it as self-promotion. I don't see Peterson trying to make a buck out of this, much as I don't see Edible Reading trying to dine out on their exploits, and I appreciate both their efforts.

I also think it's a case of can't win whatever you do. Sure, we could ask Peterson and Edible Reading to post their pieces verbatim here, at which point no doubt some folk would object to the duplication and "colonising" the internet. I can hear the cries now - "why do they have to post it all here? If I want to read it I can follow their link, I don't need to have them filling up the forum with copies of their blog posts every week."
ReadingT wrote:As for Toys R Us and Homebase closing for more flats, eugh. Some developers won't be happy until there are flat in every single location and nothing else.
Welcome to the 21st century version of London overspill. Not to mention that town planning and the social implications of such aren't the responsibility of property developers; that's for the council to oversee. Property developers are interested in turning a buck, and obviously in Reading's geographical/transport situation, flats do that.
Whilst I am a moderator, I am NOT posting in that capacity unless I explicitly say so
C8H10N4O2

Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by C8H10N4O2 »

Apologies.
It was my own personal opinion, not as a Mod.

Carrry on.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by johnH »

peterson wrote:Link removed
peterson - you link away as much as you like (psste in the full/part article if you want).

We read enough complaints on this Forum about the local press, yet when you get quality articles from local sources like peterson, eddiblereading, AltReading, people still complain! We should be encouraging and supporting these ventures.

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OLDMAN
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by OLDMAN »

I have no problems with links to blogs, in fact I have enjoyed pointing out some of the errors peterson has made on some subjects, and given extra info that they could use

Back on subject - I can understand Homebase closing as not doing very well, but Toys-r-Us

I've seen nothing in the news about them?
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by Yola »

I do despair at the endless vistas of high and semi-high rise housing springing up. It's doing the town's demographic diversity no good at all. I'm sure Toys R Us will find shed space on the town's periphery and I think Peterson's right when he conjectures that Forbury Retail Park will give way to housing or office space in the short to mid term also.

Back to the blog; can I add also from a web marketing perspective to duplicate content in multiple locations can ultimately do Edible Reading's and Reading on Thames' blogs harm in terms of Google demoting them for duplicated content. Far better to have links to the blogs as this does the reverse and boosts rankings.

Not sure if either of the blog owners is after prime positions on Google, but protocol alone says links are far better than swathes of verbage.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by dave m »

I don't see the problem with news or food reviews.
if you don't want to read it, don't!

I buy a paper every day and read every headline up to the letters section, and 80% of the stories. I select.
Then once into business, less so and sport, never.

I disagree with complaints based on the "existence" of the Heights thread/MPF and NEVER visit the word game, the transport info by Wirewiper, etc because i know i won't be interested.

it just seems very small minded to deny people the opportunity to read info? Unless completely non relevant to the community.
buseng
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by buseng »

Haven't we already lost one Homebase? The one at Calcot where the new Ikea is going.
Have to agree with others though, it seems every inch of land in this town is becoming an office block or block of flats.
Some office blocks are even being converted to flats as are many old pubs.
The stupid thing is that the prices are so high that many are still unoccupied, the one in Chatham St for instance?
zag

Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by zag »

Big scheme there, nice location for it though.

Homebase has been very quiet for a long time and isnt really in a good location for a DIY store.
dave m
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by dave m »

they may be unoccupied, but they are not unsold.

the problem is that they are being bought by overseas investors who rely not on the rental income ( tenants can be a pain) but the value increase between purchase and sale. The flats are basically being traded like commodities, not homes.

until central government does something about this, loads of units will be created that do nothing for the local population.

Not everybody wants a small house and garden, and is happy in a flat, but a mixed development would be better.

Homebase are in financial trouble, so fewer stores may be in their interest.
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piwacket
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by piwacket »

zag wrote:Big scheme there, nice location for it though.

Homebase has been very quiet for a long time and isnt really in a good location for a DIY store.
Not so sure about ''good location'' - 800+ cars emptying on to an already crowded road system round there?

And I've actually always found them very handy for shopping there for years.
There's no such thing as a free lunch
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chris_j_wood
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by chris_j_wood »

Not really sure I understand the comments here about blog promotion, as I cannot relate Coffee's objection to anything above it in the thread. I'm assuming something must have been edited or removed; at a guess a link to this blog post.

I personally very much value linking posts to other relevant web sites. This includes all the previous links I've seen to Peterson's blog, to EdibleReading's blog, or even most of the ones to getReading.

Looking specifically at Peterson's blog-linking posts, most have initiated really good discussions here. The blog posts themselves are really too lengthy to live on the forum, so I think the idea of a brief summary and link is a good one. Please, please, please, don't be put off from such posts in future.
Last edited by chris_j_wood on 22 Apr 2016 12:00, edited 3 times in total.
buseng
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by buseng »

Aren't Homebase part of Argos?

Anyway at least one ugly abortion has been turned down.
http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/readin ... d-11219734
Love this quote, “This is not Las Vegas or Hong Kong”.

Saying that I see the old BMW site is starting to be demolished.
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piwacket
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by piwacket »

buseng wrote:Aren't Homebase part of Argos?
Yes they are - which i thought was much to their detriment.
However isn't Argos being bought by Sainsbury's - so maybe ''Homebase'' will reappear within a Sainsbury site :?
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Fed-up
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by Fed-up »

Homebase have been bought by an Australian company:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-35340384
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by Mayfield »

If its going to be housing couldn't it be something like the American style of Condo's instead of this unremitting high rise ? My friend just outside Boston lives in a very pleasant development, nicely landscaped and the condo's are two bed which somehow lends itself to a different mix of occupants.
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chris_j_wood
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by chris_j_wood »

Peterson's blog wrote:Essentially, the town centre is bulging outwards and taking in these areas. Supermarkets will be re-provided on the ground floor of larger buildings. Customers will have to drive out of town to buy their sofas, or order online.
I think there is a bit of a paradox here. The reason the area around the station is becoming so valuable is because Reading is gradually becoming part of London. Yet the idea of out-of-town shopping is largely a provincial one, that doesn't really happen so much in London. Probably because many fewer people in London run cars, and because 'out-of-town' takes hours of driving to get to.

It will be interesting how exactly these two conflicting ideas play out in Reading. I believe the town already has one of the highest public to private transport ratios of anywhere outside Greater London, so 'driving out of town' may not be the answer.

On a slightly different subject, I think if I was RBC, I'd be tempted to use some delaying tactics on all these high-density developments near the station until the Lizzie Line is actually open and bedded in. My worry is that its slow speed might mean that it fails to deliver the advantages the developers are busy talking up, and that, taken with the possibility that the current London property market might turn out to be a bubble, will leave us with a lot of white elephant blocks of flats.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by AvenueOver »

Strangely I don't think it's the Reading-Paddington part of Crossrail which is tempting people to live here. It's the Paddington-Liverpool Street section. You can be in most parts of The City within an hour if you get a fast train form here to Padders, then change to a fast Crossrail to The City (24 trains per hour planned Padd - Liv St in peak times). It's going to cut half an hour off journey times to The City. People planning to get on Crossrail at Reading probably aren't going any further east than Heathrow or Ealing.
zag

Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by zag »

chris_j_wood wrote:On a slightly different subject, I think if I was RBC, I'd be tempted to use some delaying tactics on all these high-density developments near the station until the Lizzie Line is actually open and bedded in.
Under "permitted development" rights this is not possible. Any unused office block can now be converted into flats without planning permission.

What really was the problem, was all the vacant office buildings in Reading that had sat there for years doing nothing. Its great to see them come back on the market but will obviously have a huge glut of flats for the next few years until it settles down again.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by chris_j_wood »

zag wrote:
chris_j_wood wrote:On a slightly different subject, I think if I was RBC, I'd be tempted to use some delaying tactics on all these high-density developments near the station until the Lizzie Line is actually open and bedded in.
Under "permitted development" rights this is not possible. Any unused office block can now be converted into flats without planning permission.

What really was the problem, was all the vacant office buildings in Reading that had sat there for years doing nothing. Its great to see them come back on the market but will obviously have a huge glut of flats for the next few years until it settles down again.
I would agree with you on that front. But there is a world of difference between an office block and the sort of 'retail sheds' that house Homebase and Toys R Us. I assume that nobody is going to try and convert them into housing, and that this will be a demolish and build from new type of redevelopment. It was them, and things like the mega-towers proposed for the old BMW site, that I was referring to.

I was really concerned about the very high densities being proposed for these kind of developments. The office blocks being re-purposed are mostly reasonably low-rise. The few time-expired mid-rise towers that Reading had near the station, for example Nugent House and Thames Tower, have mostly now been demolished. And I get the (possibly quite wrong) idea that the practicalities of converting an office tends to lead to rather larger flats, and hence lower density, than those you would find in a purpose built residential tower.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by buseng »

chris_j_wood wrote:
zag wrote:
chris_j_wood wrote:On a slightly different subject, I think if I was RBC, I'd be tempted to use some delaying tactics on all these high-density developments near the station until the Lizzie Line is actually open and bedded in.
Under "permitted development" rights this is not possible. Any unused office block can now be converted into flats without planning permission.

What really was the problem, was all the vacant office buildings in Reading that had sat there for years doing nothing. Its great to see them come back on the market but will obviously have a huge glut of flats for the next few years until it settles down again.
I would agree with you on that front. But there is a world of difference between an office block and the sort of 'retail sheds' that house Homebase and Toys R Us. I assume that nobody is going to try and convert them into housing, and that this will be a demolish and build from new type of redevelopment. It was them, and things like the mega-towers proposed for the old BMW site, that I was referring to.

I was really concerned about the very high densities being proposed for these kind of developments. The office blocks being re-purposed are mostly reasonably low-rise. The few time-expired mid-rise towers that Reading had near the station, for example Nugent House and Thames Tower, have mostly now been demolished. And I get the (possibly quite wrong) idea that the practicalities of converting an office tends to lead to rather larger flats, and hence lower density, than those you would find in a purpose built residential tower.
Slight pick up here, Nugent House has been replaced by another one, Clearwater Court. Both owned by the infamous TW.
Isn't Thames Tower actually being increased in height? It's Western Tower that's actually gone.
Don't forget all the new office blocks being built in Forbury Road on the Metal Box site, an area already well oversubscribed with these things.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by dave m »

You need to bear in mind that as offices, old "modern" blocks are pretty useless due to modern AC and computer usage.

It is cheaper to build new spec offices than refurb, then convert the old blocks into flats. A mate in London lives in one and it is great.

IMHO better to have a row of new towers than have them scattered willy nilly
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by chris_j_wood »

buseng wrote:Isn't Thames Tower actually being increased in height? It's Western Tower that's actually gone.
Oops, you are quite right. I did mean Western Towers. The ex-BR office, not the ex-Foster Wheeler office.

It is my understanding that Thames Tower is being refurbed and increased in height for continued use as offices, rather as a conversion to residential, but I could have got the wrong end of the stick.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by buseng »

chris_j_wood wrote:
buseng wrote:Isn't Thames Tower actually being increased in height? It's Western Tower that's actually gone.
Oops, you are quite right. I did mean Western Towers. The ex-BR office, not the ex-Foster Wheeler office.

It is my understanding that Thames Tower is being refurbed and increased in height for continued use as offices, rather as a conversion to residential, but I could have got the wrong end of the stick.
Yep, another FOUR storeys.
http://www.livingreading.co.uk/thames-t ... s-unveiled
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by eddieed »

There is a planning application in to reduce the size of Staples and add another entrance as well on Forbury Retail Park...maybe toys r us will move over there with the internet they probably don't need such a big store.
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by bluemondayuk »

C8H10N4O2 wrote:If I'm alone, by all means tell me so, but I struggle to find good reason to visit anyone's blog "offered" as a contribution to a community site.
Sorry, but I just don't see anything but self-promotion.
Bit late to this, but I really like considered, well-written blogs/articles that link from here. How else would we know about them otherwise? I think it's a credit to the Forum that it's seen as a go-to for an audience. And quite often, I find the links and sites really good - Edible Reading for example, is a positive asset to the town and, therefore, to this forum as they want to post here (and are very polite about doing so).
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by OLDMAN »

eddieed wrote:There is a planning application in to reduce the size of Staples and add another entrance as well on Forbury Retail Park...maybe toys r us will move over there with the internet they probably don't need such a big store.

Sorry can't quite get that - Staples are in Forbury Retail Park so does it mean they are reducing in size and opening a new entrance from the car park?

Or

Is the Forbury Retail Park looking to have a new entrance from the road

Do you have the planning number to save me searching?
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Re: Homebase and Toys R Us Redevelopment

Post by buseng »

OLDMAN wrote:
eddieed wrote:There is a planning application in to reduce the size of Staples and add another entrance as well on Forbury Retail Park...maybe toys r us will move over there with the internet they probably don't need such a big store.

Sorry can't quite get that - Staples are in Forbury Retail Park so does it mean they are reducing in size and opening a new entrance from the car park?

Or

Is the Forbury Retail Park looking to have a new entrance from the road

Do you have the planning number to save me searching?
I take it as that Staples are reducing in size & the vacant bit which Staples leave will have a new entrance built which Toys R Us may take over.
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